Ask HN: What to do when you're out of money and can't find a job?
Hey HN,
I have reached the point of extreme desperation. I'm 39 years old, and I have been building software for 20+ years (started coding when I was 12), and I have multiple GitHub projects with 1000+ stars, and numerous with 100+. I have published 2 programming books, and have worked at some top companies.
I have been trying to find a job for the past 2 years, but I have been unable to get a single job offer after doing 100+ interviews. My last real job ended in 2019, so my resume has a 5 year gap that probably looks suspicious. In those 5+ years I started multiple (failed) businesses and spent all my savings in trying to bootstrap a small business that would provide a living for me. This looks like a huge red flag to most recruiters, but I think the HN crowd would understand.
At this point I have about a month of runway left before I can't pay rent and will face eviction, after which I have nothing to fall back on (I don't have any family or friends that can help). I am at my wits end, and I don't understand why I'm consistently rejected from every job I've applied to even though I am quite good at computers (though I'm not a good founder).
I also made the mistake of deleting my linkedin account years ago because I got tired of the constant barrage of spam, so now I am starting fresh with a new linkedin account and apparently most recruiters won't take you seriously unless you have lots of linkedin buddies. This seems very dumb to me, but it seems to be the current state of the hiring world (is what it is).
I know there is a lot of ageism in tech, and being 39 makes me a dinosaur. I have been rejected multiple times because I was told I was too old, though never in those terms ("not a good culture fit" yadda yadda).
I'm willing to work for below-average wages if it allows me to continue to survive, but communicating this to recruiters or anyone who's hiring is a signal of desperation, and nobody wants to hire people who are desperate.
Aside from getting a job at Starbucks, does anyone have any advice on how I can continue to survive? I'm out of ideas ("hacks") and short on time. Spamming my resume at every job ad I can find isn't working and I don't know what else to do.
Cheers and happy holidays!
Not advice, but...
Companies seem to be definitely interested in you, if you get to the interview stage. They do see your gap of 5 years, your age (I assume both are present in your CV), but in the past 2 years, you got on average an interview every week. This is actually quite enviable. If companies wouldn't be interested in you, they wouldn't spend the time interviewing you.There will be some other recurring pattern that makes them change their mind...
Adding to this:
Coming to the interview stage, carry yourself with confidence when explaining the 5+ year gap. Do not fall into assuming it was wasted time because you didn't reach a target goal. Maybe that assumption will be unconsciously conveyed to whoever you speak to. Examine your conclusion about the past engagement. View it as part of a constant learning experience to get better. Base the confidence on the fact that you bravely chose to throw yourself into new difficult territory. In discussing any of the gap, focus on what the challenges were, what your plan was, what you learned, and where you aspire to go next.
I hope a positive essence can be seen here beyond any oversimplification I may have made. There likely are more practical things to consider as well. My point is to also work on framing one's past engagement in a positive light as part of learning, not as a conclusive failure.
I am guilty of this, I usually talk about my time as an entrepreneur negatively because, to be frank, I'm ashamed of my failure. Thanks for the insight, it's helpful and I should have thought more about this earlier.
yeah this, always baffles me when people look down on their entrepreneurial pursuits instead of bragging it
it's not like you learned nothing and became rusty because you just smoked weed and played video games all day
You have to realize your priority is to find income, not to find a tech job, so bite the bullet and take any work you can, at least until things are more stable. You might not have any friends or family to help financially, but you're more likely to find work through someone you know, or someone they know, etc., so try to get your foot in a door by those degrees of separation, instead of random recruiters or job postings. Once you're working, try networking through your new coworkers to find a better job.
Why is there a 5 year gap on your resume? It sounds like you didn't sit around twiddling your thumbs... you built stuff during that time. On your resume, treat it like you were working a job and talk about what you built. Highlight your open source contributions and if possible, tie them to your resume. Sure, some people will treat an ex-founder as a negative, but many will see it positive. You only need one job.
There is definitely ageism in tech, but 39 isn't old. I'd be happy to take a look at your resume and provide advice if you give me a way to contact you. But it sounds like the issue isn't your resume... indeed you are getting lots of interviews, so maybe it's something you are doing in the interview process. Do you have a sense of where things go wrong? Are you often getting to the final stage before hearing no?
Of those 100 interviews I'd estimate:
- ~70% never go past the recruiter screen
- ~20% rejection after the technical screen (i.e., leetcoding)
- ~10% after a full round of interviews
Presumably I do or say something in interviews that is working against me. I also think that my background gives people the expectation that I should be able to reach a very high bar, and perhaps I set their expectations much higher than I can actually achieve (at least in interviews). Given my real-life interactions, I can confidently say I'm a fairly gregarious and affable person, so I doubt it's my personality that's the issue. But who knows, perhaps my ego is the problem.
I get the impression from a quick skim of your resume that you are all in on Rust.
Do you mainly apply to rust jobs? I feel like I read something here recently with others really struggling to get Rust jobs.
I'm a bit confused - where did the OP post their résumé?
They must have edited it out.
I'm a bit older than you but I only put the last ~12 years of experience on my resume. No need to date yourself.
When I was ready to move on from my last job, I did a lot of mock interviews, both on pramp.com initially for free, then later interviewing.io for paid interviews. That helped a lot.
You should not have a "five year gap". Presumably you started a company, did you register the company? Put your failed company name, and put yourself as CTO or Chief Engineer or something.
Get realistic, take a small job and keep upgrading your skills at home. Try to understand what you are missing that companies want. Unfortunately no one is going to tell you. Maybe you need to focus on an adjacent area that has open opportunities. This is what I do to get jobs but it takes time:
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42297409
Well said
I had a similar experience finding my last job. 39 like you.
It can be an uphill battle and interviews feel like you're under a microscope. However, like others have said, 100 interviews means you made it to the at bat.
The way to look at age is that you have to somehow make it clear you bring waaay more knowledge and experience .. unless you don't. You have to figure out a way to do this.
When an employer interviews someone with 15 years of experience and they are an IC, the obvious questions are:
- how has this person grown?
- what are their ambitions?
You have to somehow make clear that you aren't stagnating in your career and that you continue to grow in _some_ dimension.
I've been researching Rust and it seems to be mainly used in embedded systems.
Have you made the funding rounds? A Rust based system which runs on Sidewalk and manages power use in households seems really needed. A few years ago a product which more accurately manages dryer time (and therefore saves homeowners money and energy) was shut down to the general gnashing of teeth. TBH, I wanted to revive it myself almost immediately, but I don't have any bonafides and I had a ton of other things on my plate to try and fix.
As far as I know, it hasn't been revived yet. I'm sure that other use cases will appear. The energy one is foremost because we are facing a huge energy deficit over the next few years (5-10). Homeowners will have to start producing some, if not all, of their own power as private companies take over the grid. They are making deals already and getting sued for them. The estimates are that we need ~$2t to do upgrades;but I believe it is more like 2.5x times that and it doesn't seem to have trickled down yet.
Soon enough Amazon Power Systems, Meta Power and GPower will be controlling whether or not you can have ac during peak hours or if you can keep the lights on....and certain businesses will be prioritized over the masses for sure. If you are as well known for Rust as I suspect...you should have minimal problems raising a few million to take this on. Looking for a regular person job..is pointless at your stage in life because most places won't hire you. You are too well known and they would consider you vastly overqualified. So instead of heading downstream, head up.
Purdue has invented new charging cables which will speed up ev charging time, but I am curious as to whether or not the same tech will work over longer distances and could then be used for residential systems. If so, then a monitoring system which is more stable and accurate, while being easy to maintain sounds like a perfect fit.
Good Luck
If you want the info about the company that closed, my email addy is in the box
Are you close to a big tech hub? If you are not close try and get as close as possible. Crash with a fried or relative.
Another option is to contact Profs at CS/CE Depts at universities preferably with Startup Incubators attached. The one's that have funding for projects have a hard time finding experienced people. You might get a part time gig that turns into something long term.
Similarly, I regularly see lots of HPC support job openings at universities in the US. These pay much less than similar jobs in the real world and they are not particularly well advertised -- you have to go looking for them. Could keep the op in the black until something better is found.
Look for very small companies/IT shops/Agencies (<20 people) and talk to the founder(s) directly. Make a case and if you truly are someone who can build things, those small companies will hire you if you can do the job well and are dependable.
Your resume looks fine, and you're getting to interviews.
Why have you been rejected from 20 phone screens and 10 interviews? Can you tell whether you are meeting the technical bar? If not, maybe you are missing something about how you present yourself in interviews.
As for suggestions, make a list of a dozen people you've worked with in the past who enjoyed working with you. Reach out to them and ask if their company is hiring (and don't bring up how desperate you are).
Overall though, there's something you're not telling us, because there's something you're not seeing. The absolute best thing to do is too get a friend to do a mock interview, to try to uncover what keeps going wrong.
The mock interview idea is good, that's not something I've tried. Thanks!
Another idea you can try in addition to mock interviews is tell chat gpt to give brutal and honest feedback and have it verbally ask software engineering questions. You can also have it ask specific question categories you can expect, like working with ambiguity, conflict, etc.
This will give you extra practice and the feedback is pretty useful in my opinion!
Regardless of how you feel about LinkedIn, it is where the recruiters are. Highly recommend spinning it back up, flushing out your experience, and connecting with anyone you have had a legit business relationship with. Your network is your opportunity, and is always superior to throwing CVs at the ATS gate.
Separately, I want to suggest a solution to your original quandary.
Develop another interest that can in a pinch become a side gig. Go look on Reddit to see what people post as side gigs. Do some analysis, learn and execute.
How do you do on the take home projects and programming interview questions?
I know people do mock interviews to prep for FAANG for free online, so you may want to do that to get feedback on how you interview.
In general they say your age is a very difficult time. To be alone and without family and struggling financially at that age spells dark times. Your situation sounds real and I think it’s fine to maybe add you had personal or family issues that you have been working on while doing freelance.
Try to hold on to the fact that people are not animals and many people will empathize as long as you present it well (you don’t need to spill your guts).